Hello everyone, here we are with the latest installment of The Infertility Blog, which will discuss the differences between Clomid and Letrozol.
This one is a little medical, but I think I can get everyone through it just fine. I'll start by saying both do the same thing, they both stimulate ovulation, but each does it in it's own way. Both are pills, both can work great in women who are anovulatory, both work only fairly well for regularly menstruating infertile women.
Let's go over Clomid first. The generic name of Clomid is clomiphene citrate. It also goes by Serophene. Clomid is a drug that has been around since the 60’s. In the lab it was discovered that this compound blocks estrogen. This does not sound like a good fertility drug if it’s blocking estrogen. In fact the developers thought that since it blocks estrogen , it may be a good contraceptive. Well it had the opposite effect. Why? After swallowing Clomid, it gets taken through the blood stream to all parts of the body, including the brain. The brain is important because that is where all of the control of ovulation starts. Normal ovulation can not happen without signals from the brain and pituitary gland. When Clomid, the "anti-estrogen", gets to the brain, things start happening.
More about this in a moment, first a bit about how estrogen works. Estrogen, like all hormones, exerts its influence by landing on a receptor. A receptor is a protein either on the surface or inside the cell that recognizes a hormone and binds to the hormone. It is the receptor/hormone combination that then causes the cell to do what the hormone says to do. For example, after estrogen binds to the estrogen receptor the combined hormone/receptor can get the cervical cells make mucus for example. It's very much like a lock and key. The estrogen is a key that only works in the estrogen lock (the estrogen receptor). Other hormones, like progesterone and testosterone, float around and then only bind with their receptors. Like a key, different hormones have slightly different shapes, and the receptors will only connect with a hormone if the hormone has the right shape.
OK, back to Clomid and the brain. When Clomid gets to the brain, because the Clomid molecule has a similar shape as the estrogen molecule, Clomid binds to the estrogen receptor. But because the shape of the Clomid molecule is not exactly the same as the estrogen molecule , the estrogen receptor Clomid combination is faulty, and can not signal the cell to do anything. Elsewhere in the body, the cervical cells will not make mucus. for example. The Clomid takes up all of the available places on the receptor so that the estrogen has nowhere to land, thus the actions of estrogen are blocked.
No estrogen, that is what the brain thinks. The brain says, “Hey, what happened, who turned off the estrogen?” So the brain tries to make more. Estrogen only comes from the ovary, with a few small exceptions, so the only way for the body to get estrogen is to stimulate the ovaries to start ovulating. This is accomplished by the brain stimulating the pituitary gland to put out bursts of FSH, which then travels through the blood stream to the ovaries and gets ovulation going. For most women, this estrogen block is not 100%. Its enough of a block to get ovulation going, but usually the Clomid can spare complete havoc the endometrium (uterine lining) and cervical mucus. In some women, but a small percentage, there is complete havoc; the cervical mucus completely dries up (overcome by insemination) and the uterine lining becomes too thin (can not be overcome).
This is why some doctors give estrogen and Clomid at the same time. It is believed that the Clomid will get the ovulation started and the given estrogen will counteract the Clomid in the uterus and cervix. I have not had much success with this method. I have found that if the Clomid creates havoc, adding estrogen does not help.
Clomid works wonders for women who have irregular cycles, Clomid allow for more frequent, predictable ovulation, and this ups the odds of conception. Women with PCO are excellent candidates for Clomid because they have irregular cycles, which could be anywhere from every 35 days to every 6 months to never. Women who have irregular cycles but are not exactly PCO also have excellent results with Clomid. Women who do not get their periods due to exercise, eating disorders or other types of women with “hypothalamic amenorrhea” usually do not respond to Clomid. This is because their brains do not respond to the Clomid because the brain knows that if there is severe stress or no food coming in, it’s not a good time to get pregnant, so even clomid will not work.
We ask women to take Clomid (and letrozol) early in the cycle because we want to give the boost in FSH early so that maybe we can coax the ovary to make more than one egg that month. FSH rises from Clomid, and it's the FSH that really does all of the work to initiate ovulation. In women who get periods every 4 months, it really does not matter if Clomid is given days 5, 10 20 or 30. We would prefer if you were not pregnant when taking Clomid (although it happens and probably not a problem), that’s why we wither give Provera to bring on a period or do a pregnancy test before you start. So that’s a little about Clomid. It works by blocking estrogen from it’s receptor. More to come next time.
Thanks for reading and please read disclaimer 5/17/06.
Dr. Licciardi
Amazing blog!
ReplyDeleteI turned 40 in July. My cycles are regular, every 27-30 days with LH surging on Day 13. I was pregnant in January but miscarried after 8w0d. We conceived naturally after trying for 3 months. Before that pregnancy my FSH was 5, prolactin 12 and I had a normal hsg. My husband's s.a. was vol 4cc, con 102, mot 58, and morph 35. He is 47. We've tried naturally from May-September. This month my ob/gyn prescribed 50mg of clomid, I had my lh surge on day 13, he gave me an u/s and found two good sized follicles, he gave me a hcg trigger shot and 3 days after my lh surge I took crinone 8% for 8 nights and then 100mg of prometrium 2x a day. I did not conceive. We didn't do IUI we tried naturally with those meds. He suggests the same course this month. Yesterday, I took new day 3 blood work. I am nervously waiting for these results today. My question is, do you think I should continue with clomid or goto an RE for another course of action? I'm originally from Manhattan but have been living in Beverly Hills for the last two years.
Oh...forgot to mention I also took 1mg of estradoil from after I finished the clomid until the end of my cycle.
ReplyDeleteI don't know if you've seen this article: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17616859 regarding the use of an extended clomid protocol in women with hypothalamic amenorrhea. I have seen it work even in women who do not respond to Provera, and I think it's a good thing to try, particularly when injectables or IVF are not covered by insurance. No harm in trying, right?
ReplyDeleteHi - I got excited when I saw this post because it's so specific to my situation. I was put on Clomid for anovulation and didn't have success with it, then had to stop taking it because of a side effect I was getting with triple vision. My doctor started me on letrozole, and the first month I ovulated. I'm feeling much more positive about letrozole, but really would like to hear what you have to say about it; it looks like this post is focused on just the clomid. Looking forward to the next part!
ReplyDeleteThis was very informative. Clomid wreaked havoc on my mind causing severe depression. It made me ovulate but I got so depressed I could barely get out of bed. I never took anything since then (a little over 2 years ago) because we decided to take a break after that and never officially went off our break. Come check out my blog at www.hannahtohannah.blogspot.com for the rest of my story including my miscarriage that happened after I went of Clomid while we were on a break.
ReplyDeleteThis is a really informative blog, and I thank you for it. I'm 42 and have undergone lots of infertility treatment over the last year or so. I've had 4 iuis, the last of which was from a converted (failed) ivf cycle. I didn't respond well to the medications last time.
ReplyDeleteThis time they started me on an estrogen priming protocol, which I still don't totally understand. I was hoping you could explain what this really means.
They have me taking a vivelle patch every other day and ganerelix for 3 nights. I just took my last one tonight and this is my CD1.
They're going to start me on a lupron microdose tomorrow with follistim and menopur. I know you said lupron itself isn't something you often use, but what about lupron microdose. I'm told it's a very different thing dosage wise...could you explain how it differs and why some doctors use it for poor responders?
nice post on infertility
ReplyDeleteHello, thank you for this blog, the information is fantastic!
ReplyDeleteNot sure if this is the place for this, but I have a question not pertaining to this particular blog post, but infertility in general. I am 28 years old and have been off of birth control for approx. 8 months and have not gotten pregnant yet. I work out 4-5x per week and lead a fairly healthy lifestyle, and I get regular periods every 24-30 days. I am wondering if my level of physical activity could be an issue? Also, I waited until marriage to have intercourse, so there was some difficulty "down there" to start, and though I receive healthy gyno exam results each year, they have described my cervix as "fragile." Not sure if this, too, could pose any difficulty for me in conceiving?
Thanks for your blog and for answering our questions, super helpful!
Dear Dr. Licciardi,
ReplyDeleteThank you for your blog. I have a question about Clomid and endometriosis. Do women with endo have a higher chance of developing cysts with Clomid? I have read that endometriosis is caused by estrogen dominance, and from your explanation of how Clomid works it seems that it might exacerbate the disease.
I am 33, diagnosed endo in 2008 with a left endometrioma (laparoscopic excision). HSG, ultrasounds, and hormonal bloodwork have since come back normal. My FSH is 10. My husband, 34, has low motility and may have ASA due to childhood inguinal hernia surgery and a varicocele removal in adolescence. We have been trying to conceive for over a year and are wondering whether I should do another lap or try IVF after a few cycles of IUI. I would like to try natural cycle IUI first because I don't want to make the endometriosis worse. I have not had much pain after the surgery, due to modified diet and weekly acupuncture.
Any opinion you may have about whether to do a lap or IUI-IVF, and/or the best ovarian stimulation protocol for someone with endometriosis, would be hugely appreciated! Thank you so much.
After a great response to the antogonist protocol, I had a successful elective SET with one of your colleagues at NYU (yay!!) We now have 9 frozen day-5 embryos there for future children. We had initially wanted to do PDG but were dissuaded at the time; that decision has weighted on my mind since (despite my healthy pregnancy), and so I am thinking of the future. My question now is what are success rates & is it even possible to perform PDG on frozen day 5 blasts? At the time of transfer & freezing I was 30, and we were diagnosed with "unexplained infertility" (just as my parents were 30+ yrs ago. It took them 8 yrs to finally conceive after continuous failed cycles utilizing every available fertility treatment in the 70s, mainly clomid & eventually some sort of injectible that my mom doesn't recall. I inlcude this info to demonstrate that I believe there is some sort of genetic problem modern medicine has yet to uncover. Also, I am a CF carrier though my husband tested "unlikely"). My doctor described our embryos as all being of excellent quality which is why we were on board with the SET, and all but 2 made it to freeze (leaving the 9 we have now). Thank you!
ReplyDeleteI am from India. When I started my traetment in 2005, I was given Letroz 2.5 mg (3 tab x 5 days). When we checked about it on web, we came to know that it is a banned tablet. Even after 5 years, I was being treated with the same medicine. We spoke to so many doctors and everyone said it is fine. A few days back this tablet has been banned in India (for infertility treatment). Since I am not taking traetment for last 1 1/2 years, I am not sure whether the doctors in india are still using it or not...I have gievn the details about my treatment in by blog http://wanna-be-a-mom.blogspot.com
ReplyDeleteThis is the right blog for anyone who wants to find out about this topic. I really appreciate your wonderful knowledge and the time you put into educating the rest of us. Estrogen only comes from the ovary, with a few small exceptions, so the only way for the body to get estrogen is to stimulate the ovaries to start ovulating. This is very helpful information. We are all about sharing resources and information that will help more families better afford treatment.
ReplyDeletereproductive health
i feel like i'm missing something here. the subject of dr licciardi's post says "letrozol" but he doesnt' discuss anything about letrozol in the post. there's NO info about letrozole so, how can he say he's describing the difference between the two???
ReplyDeleteDr. Licciardi - I am so greatful for your blog. I am 36, PCO, and have always had my FSH tested in the 5-6 range. I've had two clomid/HCG iui cycles, and just had my date 2 tested, and my FSH is 9.0 with E2 of 50! I'm in a panic - it was only 5.2 FSH / E2 34 3 months ago, and those were typical numbers. I am worried because my mother hit menopause at 40, so I've had a longstanding fear of early menopause too. Can the 9.0 be the result of last month's Clomid, or is it fair to just assume this is the start of the perimenopause spike. I'm so worried. If it's a spike, I may stop my IUI cycles and instead go for fresh IVF with hopes to get frozen embryos each try. I would like 2 children, and if I'm in perimenopause already, I'd rather not spend a year pregnant with nothing in the freezer. Please advise if Clomid in one month can artificially raise FSH next. Thank you.
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ReplyDeleteHome-Check Instant Ovulation Test is designed to detect the surge in Luteinizing Hormone (LH). The body always makes small amounts of LH but prior to ovulation it makes far more. This test device will detect the LH surge which happens in the middle of your menstrual cycle, about 1 -1.5 days before ovulation.
ReplyDeleteHome-Check Instant Ovulation Test is designed to detect the surge in Luteinizing Hormone (LH). The body always makes small amounts of LH but prior to ovulation it makes far more. This test device will detect the LH surge which happens in the middle of your menstrual cycle, about 1 -1.5 days before ovulation.
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ReplyDelete"Clomid vs Letrozol".Thanks for sharing such information.Pharmacy Wholesaler
I am 33 years old. I got off BC pill at the end of March last year and didn't start a period until July 2011. I had 2 cycles and then it was irregular, very light bleeding every 2 months. That's when I sought a RE and diagnosed with thin PCOS. not a ton of cysts and AMH not expectionally high. He put me on 50mg clomid. Due to the cost of the visits we decided to just check OPK and do a manual exam for cysts before moving on. I wasn't sure if I ovulated because the OPK was inconclusive but I did have a little discharge exactly 13 days later (but not full flow). So we went to 100mg. We went ahead and did a ultrasound and found very large and multiple follicles and a thin uterine lining (4mm)- during that time OPK were negative BUT my estradiol was like 5,000! I was told that it doesn't make sense. With that level I should have a thicker lining and stimulated ovulation. We decided to go down to 25mg and when I went in for the day 14 ultrasound it showed a few follicles and estradiol in 300s. We repeated the ultrasound on day 17 and the uterine lining was 4mm and follicles only 12mm so he decided not to do the Ovidrel. I don't make sense. I had periods from age 16-18 (i think regularly). I have secondary sexual characteristics but my pituitary is not secreting LH and my uterus is not responding to the estrogen that's being produced. My other pituitary function is normal (thyroid, FSH). My RE wants me to have an endometrial biopsy and have several geneticist and specialist look at my estrogen receptor and transcription factors. I don't remember the specific names. Have you ever encountered this before and what do you recommend? All I care about is getting pregnant.
ReplyDeleteI took 7 cycles of Clomid and all it did was wreak havoc with my system. My periods have always been regular, and I've always ovulated. My doc kept saying that I just needed a little "boost". The only blood work they ever did was to check my thyroid and my husband's sperm count. During my 3rd cycle of clomid my period showed up 2 weeks early and hurt like a mother! It was so heavy. My periods are never that heavy!! They are actually pretty light usually. After I mentioned it to my doc just upped my dose. Since we're self pay, and after 7 months of hell with clomid we've decided to stop trying. I'm absolutely terrified of pumping more hormones into my body at this point. I'm almost 38 years old, we don't qualify to adopt so we'll never have a child.
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